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Old 12-04-2017, 01:20 AM   #1
CrAKker
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Default I scratched my UnderFolder itch. NPAP DF (Updated with range report and photos).....

I know you folks will appreciate that title, and please, feel free to run with it! Pictures forthcoming. (Update: Pics linked in post twelve) NPAP DF was my choice, and first, out of the box, zeroed AK.

Wow! Great shooter. Front sight post dead center in the ears. Rivets look very nice. The stock is brand new stiff and locks up tightly with acceptable wiggle.

Kudos to Century, as the magazine lock up is very good to slightly tight. As well as the RAK 47 FCG, Clean pull, reasonable break, and very positive reset.

It ate everything I fed it today, from Walmart Tula 122GR FMJ's, to Golden Tiger 124FMJ's, to Monarch-Barnaul 123GRHP's, to SGA ammo Tula 8M3 124GR HP's. 140 rounds with ZERO malfunctions in total. ZERO malfunctions.

Boy these UF's are handy to tote around. I see the appeal to them after today. The only mods I did to it before even Zeroing it was, a Tapco FCG retaining plate, a Tapco SAW grip, which I immediately stippled, and a paracord wrap on the left side UF steel stock beam.

Very comfortable, and pleasant shooter. I'm glad I went with a straight stock, Combloc variant for my first UF. 12xxx serial range from Atlantic Firearms.

Offhand shots at 100 yards were very doable as long as we did our part. Multiple shooters were very impressed.
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Originally Posted by uao85
"I invest in precious metals. The fact that mine is primarily in lead and brass should be of no concern to anybody." Plus magazines and this is a no lose investment!

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Old 12-04-2017, 04:49 AM   #2
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What's the general consensus on the NPAP anyway? They're cheap as shit but seem to hold up pretty well.

I kinda want one...probably go underfolder like you did.
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Old 12-04-2017, 07:31 AM   #3
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Just had my Npap DF out and cleaned her up the other day. Got it from Atlantic 2 years ago and is one of my favorites. Only added a Tapco FCG retaining plate and a polytech blond PG which matched perfect.
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Old 12-04-2017, 07:57 AM   #4
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Keep scratching and it will spread.
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Old 12-04-2017, 08:40 AM   #5
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Good call
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Old 12-04-2017, 09:09 AM   #6
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I sure like mine.
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Old 12-04-2017, 11:13 AM   #7
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Originally Posted by CrAKker View Post
I know you folks will appreciate that title, and please, feel free to run with it! Pictures forthcoming. NPAP DF was my choice, and first, out of the box, zeroed AK.

Wow! Great shooter. Front sight post dead center in the ears. Rivets look very nice. The stock is brand new stiff and locks up tightly with acceptable wiggle.

Kudos to Century, as the magazine lock up is very good to slightly tight. As well as the RAK 47 FCG, Clean pull, reasonable break, and very positive reset.

It ate everything I fed it today, from Walmart Tula 122GR FMJ's, to Golden Tiger 124FMJ's, to Monarch-Barnaul 123GRHP's, to SGA ammo Tula 8M3 124GR HP's. 140 rounds with ZERO malfunctions in total. ZERO malfunctions.

Boy these UF's are handy to tote around. I see the appeal to them after today. The only mods I did to it before even Zeroing it was, a Tapco FCG retaining plate, a Tapco SAW grip, which I immediately stippled, and a paracord wrap on the left side UF steel stock beam.

Very comfortable, and pleasant shooter. I'm glad I went with a straight stock, Combloc variant for my first UF. 12xxx serial range from Atlantic Firearms.

Offhand shots at 100 yards were very doable as long as we did our part. Multiple shooters were very impressed.
Good purchase ,never had a problem with mine at over 3000 rds not one hiccup.Do yourself a favor get an Urban ERT recoil pad install shoot rifle and report back. A great gun you'll enjoy,and often seriously underrated.
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Old 12-04-2017, 11:34 AM   #8
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i am convinced that None of you actually own one



No pics ??
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Old 12-04-2017, 12:20 PM   #9
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Picked one up for 400,

Nice rifle... It's my travel/truck gun...

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Old 12-04-2017, 12:35 PM   #10
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No complaints with my npap df. It’s a quality combloc for a good price.
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Old 12-04-2017, 01:19 PM   #11
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I have 2 Veprs 3 yugos but I gave my son my n pap. I like the m92 and o pap but the yugo pap is one of my favorite ak’s. I have the m70ab2 underfolder. I’ve shot it so much it needs a new recoil spring.
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Old 12-04-2017, 06:09 PM   #12
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Here is nine rounds of Tula 122GR FMJ straight out of the box. Like I said, this is my first AK that is Zeroed out of the box.
http://imgdump4.novarata.net/image.u...103efbdbbe.jpg
Does this gas block look cast to you? It sure does to me. http://imgdump4.novarata.net/image.u...de070b5da4.jpg
Unfortunately, no proof marks on my example. http://imgdump4.novarata.net/image.u...25e7297f04.jpg
Overall, I'm very pleased so far.http://imgdump4.novarata.net/image.u...e363b9c1dc.jpg
Excellent rifle thus far. I'm looking forward to some benchwork at Leeds rifle range sometime soon. I'm going to dial her in with GT 124GR FMJ and Tula 8M3 on that session.
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Originally Posted by uao85
"I invest in precious metals. The fact that mine is primarily in lead and brass should be of no concern to anybody." Plus magazines and this is a no lose investment!

Last edited by CrAKker; 12-04-2017 at 06:19 PM.
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Old 12-04-2017, 06:53 PM   #13
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Quote:
Does this gas block look cast to you? It sure does to me. http://imgdump4.novarata.net/image.u...de070b5da4.jpg
Looks like cast to me as well. The finish on mine is a lot smoother. The wood on mine was really dirty/rough so I cleaned it with acetone and wet sanded with boiled linseed oil with 220 grit paper. Looks a lot nicer now.

Also, I don't think Zastava does a great job of getting all the bluing salts out of the rifle. CLP'd everything really well and blew out the inside of the receiver with air compressor and there was a ton of orange-ish rusty oil from the CLP that I got out of the receiver.
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Old 12-04-2017, 09:43 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CrAKker View Post
Here is nine rounds of Tula 122GR FMJ straight out of the box. Like I said, this is my first AK that is Zeroed out of the box.
http://imgdump4.novarata.net/image.u...103efbdbbe.jpg
Does this gas block look cast to you? It sure does to me. http://imgdump4.novarata.net/image.u...de070b5da4.jpg
Unfortunately, no proof marks on my example. http://imgdump4.novarata.net/image.u...25e7297f04.jpg
Overall, I'm very pleased so far.http://imgdump4.novarata.net/image.u...e363b9c1dc.jpg
Excellent rifle thus far. I'm looking forward to some benchwork at Leeds rifle range sometime soon. I'm going to dial her in with GT 124GR FMJ and Tula 8M3 on that session.


My gas block looks nothing like that... Smooth, with clear machining lines running up.

Last edited by Maxxsmart; 12-04-2017 at 10:25 PM.
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Old 12-05-2017, 03:51 AM   #15
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Scratching spreads rashes
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Old 12-05-2017, 08:59 AM   #16
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PICS !!!!!!!!! PICS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! PICS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Indeed
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Old 12-05-2017, 09:32 AM   #17
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Originally Posted by CrAKker View Post
Does this gas block look cast to you? It sure does to me. http://imgdump4.novarata.net/image.u...de070b5da4.jpg
The gasblock on my OPAP looks a lot darker and smoother (like has been mentioned previously). But that said, I had an NPAP a few years ago and sold it to buy my OPAP. I liked the NPAP, I just wanted the OPAP more, even though its heavy as a tank

But I did see several differences between the two rifles. Maybe they are built with different materials and specs? I know that's the case with the receivers, but maybe with other parts as well.

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Old 12-05-2017, 12:26 PM   #18
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What's the general consensus on the NPAP anyway? They're cheap as shit but seem to hold up pretty well.

I kinda want one...probably go underfolder like you did.
I paid $475 for mine in August of this year and although it's the second least expensive firearm I own, it one of my favorite to shoot.

It's closing in on 1500 rounds and none of the Rob Ski check points are exhibiting any problems whatsoever.

The furniture is only "range grade" rather than suited for rough field use; but the fit and finish of all the parts as well as the rivets is IMO, very well done.

The Century trigger is excellent too and far superior to the stock triggers on any of my ARs.

I've been treating the rifle with kid gloves though; no pushups, no throwing down onto hard concrete on each side, no tossing into a lake or filling with sand, and I haven't run the rifle over with my SUV.

It's been getting broken down, closely inspected, cleaned and lubed, after every range session of about 100 rounds of 123 grain Wolf Polyformance.
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Old 12-05-2017, 05:06 PM   #19
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Congrats, and for what its worth in my opinion, the NPAP-DF is hands down the best underfolding option on the market right now.

Personally, I've owned 2 of them. Also I've sold maybe 75-80 through the store.
Of mine, one was bought when these first came out....2013 i think it was? I put about 800-900 rds through it, but then let a friend talk me out of it ayear later. I agreed to sell as I felt I had too many UF AKs and we were buying a new house anyway. So that one probably turned into a dishwasher or something? hehe
My second I bought just over a year ago, so in fall of 2016. I just couldn't pass it up for the money at the time, and anyway had been missing having a Yugo pattern UF in the collection. We have a first-shots video of it that we posted last New Years. Since then, I've only put maybe 500 rds through it total, but don't hate me. I have a good number of rifles to shoot for work, so my personal guns don't get the range time they once did. I do have some 'high' round count (say over 4k-5k) in my collection though, including my SAR-1 and SAR-2.

Neither of my own NPDFs ever gave me any problems or broke any parts. My friend who bought my first says he loves it, and I know he's put at least a few hundred more rounds through it. Recently, he bought a second NPDF from me back in September, so yeah he must like the first. I think this one he'll keep set back 'new' for his son though.

In addition, i sold another long time friend one back this summer but since I don't know how many rounds he's put through it, I can't really add anything with him yet.

Of the 70+ others I've sold through my store? I've not received any complaints or returns from those customers.

My only advice is to swap out the recoil spring. It seems at least some NPAPs have either too weak springs or are over gassed, or maybe some X39 ammo is loaded hotter here than in Serbia? No matter the reason, I'd say put a different recoil spring in when you get time. You could either do a Wolf extra power or just a standard Comblock from a different AK. Lately, I've been using standard Comblock springs more....they can be had for $3 or free in excellent surplus condition.
This may not at all be required, probably isn't..but doing this gives me peace of mind for very little money/effort, so why not?

As to Rob Ski's tests, I'll just point out that he only tested the original fixed stock NPAP M70. He did not test either the fixed stock, heavy receiver OPAP M70 or the underfolding stock NPAP-DF.
This is important because he was having some problems with the rear trunnion and its rivets on the fixed stock NP, but the NPDF uses a different rear trunnion and different rivet pattern. So just because one might have issues, since the other uses different parts, its not a great idea to jump to conclusions.

NPDF owners nearly universally report a good experience, without major issues. However, as has been pointed out here before, te UF version in the PAP line probably accounts for less than 10% of the total here in the USA. So with more fixed stockers out there, we have a larger dataset and thus better results for showing issues.
It could be that the NPDF is rock solid, without problems. Or could be that simply enough people haven't put enough rounds through theirs to uncover potential issues.

In the end, I'll just say what I usually say....for the money, its a good rifle, and 'don't worry, be happy!'
Just enjoy your gun. Life's too short for worrying about theoretical, possible, maybe problems.

If you want to worry about something, worry about these assholes that try and play on their phones while driving! Christ, those people are scary and all too real!
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Old 12-05-2017, 11:24 PM   #20
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What's the general consensus on the NPAP anyway? They're cheap as shit but seem to hold up pretty well.

I kinda want one...probably go underfolder like you did.
I have personally owned and fired the veritable OPAP, the NPAP, and now the NPAP DF. All have been impressive shooters off hand. All have been boringly reliable. Honestly, the OPAP is king, and this NPAP DF I would say is > my NPAP. If you're in the market for a UF, Combloc offerings must take first consideration. It's to bad Cugir doesn't offer UFs anymore. That would be awesome.
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Old 12-06-2017, 08:44 AM   #21
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congrats on the DF! I've been tempted many times to grab one. with them being $555.19 shipped from grabagun almost makes me want to grab one.
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Old 12-06-2017, 09:00 AM   #22
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They are at a good price point now, I would be really tempted to buy if I didn't already have one. I friend wanted to buy/trade when he saw mine this week........no.
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Old 12-06-2017, 09:21 AM   #23
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Originally Posted by mishaco View Post
Congrats, and for what its worth in my opinion, the NPAP-DF is hands down the best underfolding option on the market right now.

Personally, I've owned 2 of them. Also I've sold maybe 75-80 through the store.
Of mine, one was bought when these first came out....2013 i think it was? I put about 800-900 rds through it, but then let a friend talk me out of it ayear later. I agreed to sell as I felt I had too many UF AKs and we were buying a new house anyway. So that one probably turned into a dishwasher or something? hehe
My second I bought just over a year ago, so in fall of 2016. I just couldn't pass it up for the money at the time, and anyway had been missing having a Yugo pattern UF in the collection. We have a first-shots video of it that we posted last New Years. Since then, I've only put maybe 500 rds through it total, but don't hate me. I have a good number of rifles to shoot for work, so my personal guns don't get the range time they once did. I do have some 'high' round count (say over 4k-5k) in my collection though, including my SAR-1 and SAR-2.

Neither of my own NPDFs ever gave me any problems or broke any parts. My friend who bought my first says he loves it, and I know he's put at least a few hundred more rounds through it. Recently, he bought a second NPDF from me back in September, so yeah he must like the first. I think this one he'll keep set back 'new' for his son though.

In addition, i sold another long time friend one back this summer but since I don't know how many rounds he's put through it, I can't really add anything with him yet.

Of the 70+ others I've sold through my store? I've not received any complaints or returns from those customers.

My only advice is to swap out the recoil spring. It seems at least some NPAPs have either too weak springs or are over gassed, or maybe some X39 ammo is loaded hotter here than in Serbia? No matter the reason, I'd say put a different recoil spring in when you get time. You could either do a Wolf extra power or just a standard Comblock from a different AK. Lately, I've been using standard Comblock springs more....they can be had for $3 or free in excellent surplus condition.
This may not at all be required, probably isn't..but doing this gives me peace of mind for very little money/effort, so why not?

As to Rob Ski's tests, I'll just point out that he only tested the original fixed stock NPAP M70. He did not test either the fixed stock, heavy receiver OPAP M70 or the underfolding stock NPAP-DF.
This is important because he was having some problems with the rear trunnion and its rivets on the fixed stock NP, but the NPDF uses a different rear trunnion and different rivet pattern. So just because one might have issues, since the other uses different parts, its not a great idea to jump to conclusions.

NPDF owners nearly universally report a good experience, without major issues. However, as has been pointed out here before, te UF version in the PAP line probably accounts for less than 10% of the total here in the USA. So with more fixed stockers out there, we have a larger dataset and thus better results for showing issues.
It could be that the NPDF is rock solid, without problems. Or could be that simply enough people haven't put enough rounds through theirs to uncover potential issues.

In the end, I'll just say what I usually say....for the money, its a good rifle, and 'don't worry, be happy!'
Just enjoy your gun. Life's too short for worrying about theoretical, possible, maybe problems.

If you want to worry about something, worry about these assholes that try and play on their phones while driving! Christ, those people are scary and all too real!
Nice response and my D.F. has been excellent also.
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Old 12-06-2017, 11:54 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mishaco View Post
Congrats, and for what its worth in my opinion, the NPAP-DF is hands down the best underfolding option on the market right now.

Personally, I've owned 2 of them. Also I've sold maybe 75-80 through the store.
Of mine, one was bought when these first came out....2013 i think it was? I put about 800-900 rds through it, but then let a friend talk me out of it ayear later. I agreed to sell as I felt I had too many UF AKs and we were buying a new house anyway. So that one probably turned into a dishwasher or something? hehe
My second I bought just over a year ago, so in fall of 2016. I just couldn't pass it up for the money at the time, and anyway had been missing having a Yugo pattern UF in the collection. We have a first-shots video of it that we posted last New Years. Since then, I've only put maybe 500 rds through it total, but don't hate me. I have a good number of rifles to shoot for work, so my personal guns don't get the range time they once did. I do have some 'high' round count (say over 4k-5k) in my collection though, including my SAR-1 and SAR-2.

Neither of my own NPDFs ever gave me any problems or broke any parts. My friend who bought my first says he loves it, and I know he's put at least a few hundred more rounds through it. Recently, he bought a second NPDF from me back in September, so yeah he must like the first. I think this one he'll keep set back 'new' for his son though.

In addition, i sold another long time friend one back this summer but since I don't know how many rounds he's put through it, I can't really add anything with him yet.

Of the 70+ others I've sold through my store? I've not received any complaints or returns from those customers.

My only advice is to swap out the recoil spring. It seems at least some NPAPs have either too weak springs or are over gassed, or maybe some X39 ammo is loaded hotter here than in Serbia? No matter the reason, I'd say put a different recoil spring in when you get time. You could either do a Wolf extra power or just a standard Comblock from a different AK. Lately, I've been using standard Comblock springs more....they can be had for $3 or free in excellent surplus condition.
This may not at all be required, probably isn't..but doing this gives me peace of mind for very little money/effort, so why not?

As to Rob Ski's tests, I'll just point out that he only tested the original fixed stock NPAP M70. He did not test either the fixed stock, heavy receiver OPAP M70 or the underfolding stock NPAP-DF.
This is important because he was having some problems with the rear trunnion and its rivets on the fixed stock NP, but the NPDF uses a different rear trunnion and different rivet pattern. So just because one might have issues, since the other uses different parts, its not a great idea to jump to conclusions.

NPDF owners nearly universally report a good experience, without major issues. However, as has been pointed out here before, te UF version in the PAP line probably accounts for less than 10% of the total here in the USA. So with more fixed stockers out there, we have a larger dataset and thus better results for showing issues.
It could be that the NPDF is rock solid, without problems. Or could be that simply enough people haven't put enough rounds through theirs to uncover potential issues.

In the end, I'll just say what I usually say....for the money, its a good rifle, and 'don't worry, be happy!'
Just enjoy your gun. Life's too short for worrying about theoretical, possible, maybe problems.

If you want to worry about something, worry about these assholes that try and play on their phones while driving! Christ, those people are scary and all too real!
Good advice! I put a Wolff X-tra power spring in my old WASR and it made a world of difference. I'm going to do the same based on your recommendations. So far, I'm loving this UF!
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Old 12-07-2017, 04:56 PM   #25
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they are nice, but heavy. Had one, kinda miss it.
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Old 12-08-2017, 03:45 PM   #26
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congrats on the DF! I've been tempted many times to grab one. with them being $555.19 shipped from grabagun almost makes me want to grab one.
Grabagun must be reading... the N-PAP it's now listed for $699.
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Old 12-08-2017, 07:33 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by dynacomp2002 View Post
Grabagun must be reading... the N-PAP it's now listed for $699.
you have to use their "grabaquote" function and they'll send you the $549+ $7.99 shipped quote
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Old 12-08-2017, 08:27 PM   #28
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Thanks for the tip!!
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Old Yesterday, 02:50 PM   #29
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Got her and The Draco to the range yesterday. All I can say is WOW! The Wolff +15% recoil springs arrived today and will install them in her and The Draco tonight. So far, one hundred and ninety rounds downrange with zero failures.


TULA 8M3- http://imgdump4.novarata.net/image.u...ae5e957a7c.jpg

Golden Tiger 124GR FMJ- http://imgdump4.novarata.net/image.u...0478eb10bb.jpg

By comparison, The Draco- http://imgdump4.novarata.net/image.u...1dfc227b11.jpg

This is the front sight post as it came out of the box, I have yet to touch it and doubt I will. Again, this is the first AK that has ever been GTG zeroed out of the box for me. http://imgdump4.novarata.net/image.u...f08e05f5c5.jpg
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Originally Posted by uao85
"I invest in precious metals. The fact that mine is primarily in lead and brass should be of no concern to anybody." Plus magazines and this is a no lose investment!
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