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Old 02-22-2016, 10:43 AM   #71
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Videos by Zeke Shoots on the WBP parts

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?lis...pGLjvtralslKK9
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Old 02-22-2016, 11:00 AM   #72
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I didn't notice the wet spot till you said it ......now i'm laughing while im watching it ! Like the sink in some restaurants blasts your pants when you wash your hands!! lol . back to video ..........................

I hope the castings in these hold up well............. You know the barrel is a good one . Keep us posted on this project.
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Old 02-22-2016, 05:52 PM   #73
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Like the sink in some restaurants blasts your pants when you wash your hands!! lol . back to video ..........................

I hope the castings in these hold up well............. You know the barrel is a good one . Keep us posted on this project.

LOL! I hope so as well.
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Old 02-22-2016, 06:55 PM   #74
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Sticker shock still has me
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Saving American lives, one foreign part at a time. The director must be like, "You know what keeps me up at night? Eleven or more foreign parts on a rifle."
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Old 02-22-2016, 07:05 PM   #75
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Since this was assembled by definitive how does it compare to the DAKM 4150?
this build is using the FB Radom Polish barrel..
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Old 02-22-2016, 09:12 PM   #76
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Old 02-22-2016, 09:46 PM   #77
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Like always I look forward to the videos.

Thanks to everybody involved.
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Old 02-22-2016, 10:40 PM   #78
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OH MY! Thats the most beautiful thing i have ever seen, well next to my wife LOL.
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AKs that require a recoil buffer to function are BROKEN.
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Old 02-22-2016, 11:41 PM   #79
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OH MY! Thats the most beautiful thing i have ever seen, well next to my wife LOL.
Almost as pretty as my PSA cast front trunnion....
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Old 02-23-2016, 01:50 AM   #80
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Almost as pretty as my PSA cast front trunnion....
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AKs that require a recoil buffer to function are BROKEN.
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Old 02-23-2016, 02:24 AM   #81
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So once and for all, are we talking MIM = CAST?
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Old 02-23-2016, 02:33 AM   #82
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So once and for all, are we talking MIM = CAST?
It's OK...it's not Century.
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Old 02-23-2016, 02:37 AM   #83
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What are these? MIM or investment casts?
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Old 02-23-2016, 02:49 AM   #84
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It's OK...it's not Century.
There are different grade of castings .Some are of high quality , and then some are like Century's castings .............

Do you have a permanent search for the word "cast" ,rbox1964 ?
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Old 02-23-2016, 07:45 AM   #85
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Sticker shock still has me
I've only seen pricing on the US barreled version for $899. If it were that price with the FB Radom barrel, that wouldn't be ridiculous. Only thing better would be a Childer's receiver.
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Old 02-23-2016, 08:07 AM   #86
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Atlantic Firearms will be offering a model built with WBP new parts & the FB Radom barrel and a stock set . We have some of these completed and are currently in the metal finishing process . After that we will complete our testing of the rifles and if all passes offer them for sale. We do not have a final price yet but you can be prepared for higher prices since these are all All New parts and the imported barrels.
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Old 02-23-2016, 09:31 AM   #87
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I won't pay $800 for a combloc forged AK much less $800 for a cast AK though I know I'm in a very small minority during this madness. An AK isn't worth two ARs to me even considering my opinion of ARs.

Century ran their cast rifles 5k rounds. PSA ran their gen1 cast trunnion with forged bolt for 15k rounds. I think Rob is going to run this Polish cast for 5k, call it good enough, and everyone will stampede and buy them for $800.

At least with my PSA gen1 I don't have to worry about cast bolt lugs shattering under 45000CUP in my face....

We've come a long way from these days haven't we, trashing PSA, Century, and Kalashnikov USA?
http://www.akfiles.com/forums/showthread.php?t=240013
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Old 02-23-2016, 09:40 AM   #88
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Originally Posted by 64890 View Post
We've come a long way from these days haven't we, trashing PSA, Century, and Kalashnikov USA?
http://www.akfiles.com/forums/showthread.php?t=240013
As a effect of "trashing", both, PSA and Kalashnikv USA promised to level up their parts quality and they will be offering forged trunnions and PSA moved away from Korean parts to US made parts. I would say that this is great win for consumers...
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Old 02-23-2016, 10:23 AM   #89
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As a effect of "trashing", both, PSA and Kalashnikv USA promised to level up their parts quality and they will be offering forged trunnions and PSA moved away from Korean parts to US made parts. I would say that this is great win for consumers...
You couldn't pay me to do what you are doing Rob, outstanding work.

The PSA gen1 cast trunnion with forged bolt was condemned without being tested. Now AKOU is going to compare a $799 cast AK against a $699 forged USA PSA AK. It seems to be a lose lose for you whatever the results are. Seems the WBK rifle is ready for sale soon no matter your test results.

My point is I don't understand why you're even considering testing a rifle with a cast trunnion and cast bolt that could kill you on the next shot given what I've read here in the short time I've been here. Cast=Bad wasn't it?

Then again, I believe if you blessed a pig with lipstick, many would rush to buy it. A great responsibility you have, I thank you again for taking on that responsibility.

Good luck and thanks for your enthusiasm Rob.
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Old 02-23-2016, 11:33 AM   #90
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The PSA gen1 cast trunnion with forged bolt was condemned without being tested. Now AKOU is going to compare a $799 cast AK against a $699 forged USA PSA AK. It seems to be a lose lose for you whatever the results are. Seems the WBK rifle is ready for sale soon no matter your test results.
Honestly, that isn't my issue to worry about, but rather for those, who are going to sell those rifles. I was asked to evaluate parts on this rifle in public and document the progress and this is exactly what i'm doing - no matter what end result will be...

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My point is I don't understand why you're even considering testing a rifle with a cast trunnion and cast bolt that could kill you on the next shot given what I've read here in the short time I've been here. Cast=Bad wasn't it?
WBP never was part of the original challenge - i din't even knew about their existence. But they decided to step up to the plate and said: "we will play".
Before challenge was issued, we were asking for simple data from the manufacturers tests...something like you see here: 500rds down the pipe and pictures of the components are on display. Every component wear is being documented and it will continue to go that way all the way up to 5000. We will continue to abuse it afterwards as well with follow up, documented reports. As you can see, i have openly showcased deformation of the dove tail and pointed out some other minor things...I'm not hiding anything.
Going back to question about test data from manufacturers, none of the manufacturers in question ever responded to this...Well, we could hear Yeager claiming that his RAS47 went through 50,000 rds without single failure, which is amazing on itself from the barrel longevity point of view only...I will leave it at this.

After all the bitching and moaning, at Shot Show, Kalashnikov USA pledged forged trunnions and PSA said they will have machined trunnions and forged trunnions. PSA also dropped Korean maker in favor of US maker for their parts...Nothing wrong with bringing jobs back to America...;-)

As for fear of my life, lol, as you could notice, i'm wearing my ballistic protection glasses all the time in that video. If you watch my videos, you know that this is rarity for me...So, i took some steps to protect myself.

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Then again, I believe if you blessed a pig with lipstick, many would rush to buy it. A great responsibility you have, I thank
I honestly don't think that my "blessing" or "criticism" will change anything. People will have tools (in form of video documentation) to make their own, educated decisions on those parts, but that's it.
As for my take on rifles, look, i'm openly critical about Century and IO made rifles and according to them, they had best sales ever, so i don't think that my opinion matters...
At the end of the day, it is you and not me, who pulls the trigger behind your rifle...;-)
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Old 02-23-2016, 12:41 PM   #91
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I won't pay $800 for a combloc forged AK much less $800 for a cast AK though I know I'm in a very small minority during this madness. An AK isn't worth two ARs to me even considering my opinion of ARs.

Century ran their cast rifles 5k rounds. PSA ran their gen1 cast trunnion with forged bolt for 15k rounds. I think Rob is going to run this Polish cast for 5k, call it good enough, and everyone will stampede and buy them for $800.

At least with my PSA gen1 I don't have to worry about cast bolt lugs shattering under 45000CUP in my face....

We've come a long way from these days haven't we, trashing PSA, Century, and Kalashnikov USA?
http://www.akfiles.com/forums/showthread.php?t=240013

So you're saying there will be no Arsenal in your future?


But I hear what you're saying.
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Old 02-23-2016, 02:51 PM   #92
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the damage on the carrier tail is similar to my NPAP with the G2 trigger before I adjusted the sharp edge.
the deforming on the bolt and inside the carrier where the bolts rides could be worrisome.
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Old 02-23-2016, 03:15 PM   #93
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How does say an SLR 107 hold up to a G2 trigger?
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Old 02-23-2016, 03:28 PM   #94
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All this talk of "Polish" cast vs CAI vs PSA cast, and how Polish cast is much better. I don't know much about the manufacturing of cast parts. Can someone CLEARLY explain to me HOW Polish cast parts are worlds better than how CAI's or PSA's cast parts are? What, exactly, is the difference between them (other than the generic "well, they're just made better")? I'm trying to follow along here.
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Old 02-23-2016, 03:34 PM   #95
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Can someone CLEARLY explain to me HOW Polish cast parts are worlds better than how CAI's or PSA's cast parts are? What, exactly, is the difference between them (other than the generic "well, they're just made better")?
Could you please tell me on what you are basing your assumption that those parts are better than CAI or PSA? I haven't seen any data yet which would suggest this one way or another...just saying.
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Old 02-23-2016, 03:38 PM   #96
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Could you please tell me on what you are basing your assumption that those parts are better than CAI or PSA? I haven't seen any data yet which would suggest this one way or another...just saying.
Rob, It's not from you, but in other threads people have claimed that Polish cast is GTG, while others are not. I'm just trying to stay up to date here, and understand how Polish cast parts would be different than Korean or American cast parts (I don't know the manufacturing process or if there are variances of such)?
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Old 02-23-2016, 03:40 PM   #97
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Old 02-23-2016, 03:42 PM   #98
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Its just a quality thing I think. What motivation do you have to make things top quality like someones life depended on it. Or in this case what monetary incentive.
Even the Russians (gasp) use cast pars on their AKs. I think, although I forget, they could have casted or still do cast trunions as well so big whoop.
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Old 02-23-2016, 03:54 PM   #99
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Rob, It's not from you, but in other threads people have claimed that Polish cast is GTG, while others are not. I'm just trying to stay up to date here, and understand how Polish cast parts would be different than Korean or American cast parts (I don't know the manufacturing process or if there are variances of such)?
I hear you man, but the reality is, we know very little about what exactly casting process CAI and Korea uses.
Andrew from Arms of America, posted some insides about casting methods in other threads if my memory serves well. Hopefully he, or someone else with parts manufacturing knowledge will stop by and share it here.
From my own observation, i will tell that i only see "visual differences". For example, on WBP parts, walls on parts are smooth and there is no visible pitting on those parts also that WBP don't have as visible cast lines from molds. That wasn't a case with RAS47 parts, where pitting was clearly visible and cast mold lines were easy to see right away.
Do this matter? I honestly have no clue...
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Old 02-23-2016, 04:06 PM   #100
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I hear you man, but the reality is, we know very little about what exactly casting process CAI and Korea uses.
Andrew from Arms of America, posted some insides about casting methods in other threads if my memory serves well. Hopefully he, or someone else with parts manufacturing knowledge will stop by and share it here.
From my own observation, i will tell that i only see "visual differences". For example, on WBP parts, walls on parts are smooth and there is no visible pitting on those parts also that WBP don't have as visible cast lines from molds. That wasn't a case with RAS47 parts, where pitting was clearly visible and cast mold lines were easy to see right away.
Do this matter? I honestly have no clue...
Ok. Thanks for the info Rob!
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Old 02-23-2016, 04:09 PM   #101
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How does say an SLR 107 hold up to a G2 trigger?
I had one in my 107 for a few hundred rounds before switching it out for a ALG AKT. No deformation. Not sure how much that helps since it was ~400 rounds
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Old 02-23-2016, 04:19 PM   #102
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Well, we could hear Yeager claiming that his RAS47 went through 50,000 rds without single failure, which is amazing on itself from the barrel longevity point of view only...I will leave it at this.
Anyone with common sense will clearly see that Yeager is full of shit. I find it kinda of funny how Yeager signs up with CAI, claims G2 triggers are complete crap and claims his RAS47 ran 50k flawless all around the same time frame.
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Old 02-23-2016, 05:39 PM   #103
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At the end of the day, it is you and not me, who pulls the trigger behind your rifle...;-)
You are correct. That's why I grabbed another Opap before they disappeared. I fear the cheap AK is gone and $800 is the new entry level AK. Let's see what the Wasr returns for....

Bad enough for me throwing a quarter into the woods every time I pull the trigger. In the long run, probably doesn't matter I'm running cast, the rifle will never see 1000 rounds from me.
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Old 02-23-2016, 09:32 PM   #104
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Great review! I built a Hungarian Underfolder from a parts kit for a customer. I used a G2 trigger group... I love them I love the G2! They are always a good trigger group, but this rifle had a bad bolt carrier "tail" and it deformed the customer continued firing it until it jammed into the recoil spring and cover lock I had to hammer it forward with a rawhide mallet. He fired 1000+ rounds through it, I have built over 70 different ak rifles milled and stamped. This is the only one I have ever seen cause a problem. But I have heard the Hungarian bolt carriers can deform. What was shown here is nothing compared to the bolt carrier I had to fix for him. If you have a Hungarian rifle keep your eye on that part of the bolt carrier. As far as cast parts. Russia has used cast AKM components just the small components since 1972? And Ruger makes their money by casting their firearm parts.
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Old 11-01-2017, 08:41 PM   #105
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Sorry to resurrect a dead topic but how did this turn out. Reason I ask is a customer is sending me a AOA Polish kit with the Beryl rail mount. The kit is advertised as forged trunnions and I haven't seen it yet to even guess at the quality. He's one of those cost makes no difference I just want this kit built. The link he sent is for this set. It should be a decent parts kit even if the price seems way high.
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