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Old 11-30-2017, 12:46 PM   #36
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Originally Posted by HK-91 View Post
No, gun powder did.
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yup the cartridge did
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No, gunpowder did. In the absence of the ak other rifles would have replaced it. I see tons of m16s in cartel hands.
Smokeless powder and self contained cartridges specifically.
Semi/full auto are basically impossible with black powder.
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Old 11-30-2017, 01:14 PM   #37
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Smokeless powder and self contained cartridges specifically.
Semi/full auto are basically impossible with black powder.
Absolutely. Ferdinand Mannlicher did design a smattering of self-loading black powder firearms, but the fouling rendered them inoperable after very few rounds.





Smokeless powder made self-loaders viable.
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Old 11-30-2017, 01:31 PM   #38
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yes and no
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Old 11-30-2017, 01:42 PM   #39
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I think politicians and the war "industry" kept the VC and NVA safe from decidedly rapid and decisive annihilation.
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Old 11-30-2017, 01:54 PM   #40
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Yes, ,,,,No,,,, Maybe !!!!

Don't you find it strange that in a dynamic populated with laser & plasma projector weapons,
Jedi's and their protagonists battle with light sabers ????
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Old 11-30-2017, 02:38 PM   #41
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I view the AK as a good tool that got replicated world wide due to its ruggedness, reliability and simplicity. I'm sure the fates of many villages and towns have been decided by fighters who wielded their AKs more competently than the other side, whether the winning side consisted of freedom fighters or tyrants.

But transform warfare? I'd say no. A sturdy mass produced fighting rifle was going to happen one way another, because of how warfare was and is.
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Old 11-30-2017, 05:05 PM   #42
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A sturdy mass produced fighting rifle was going to happen one way another, because of how warfare was and is.
And I bet even if the Communists never took power in Russia they would have came up with a Kalashnikov-type weapon anyway since those are the main attributes they look for in a rifle.
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Old 11-30-2017, 06:30 PM   #43
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A recent tfb video had a nam vet on for an interview, when they asked him
About enemy light and heavy machines guns he replied something like “what does a light machine matter when you have 30 vietcongs with full auto AKs”

Considering most military doctrine around WW2 centered around the LMG, whereas now it’s not as important. So I think YES it did change warfare by putting less importance on belt felt LMGs, although they still obviously have a place.
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Old 11-30-2017, 08:39 PM   #44
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Yes.

It, and the RPG, being available to about anyone who wants one changed the fighting dynamic we face.

Even Somali pirates in skiffs, Asian drug warlords, 3rd world resistance movements, and Veldt poachers have fully automatic fire and integrated antitank/short range artillery. No longer are they restrained to obsolete weapons or nothing at all and having to hide from enemy vehicles and armor.
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Old 11-30-2017, 09:32 PM   #45
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Yes
Remember the old phrase "God created man .. Samuel Colt made them equal"
The AK is, has and will continue to be a worldwide equalizer for millions.
That will be its legacy.
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Old 11-30-2017, 11:27 PM   #46
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I think mikhail kalashnikov made it easier to equip and train conscripts and citizen-soldiers with the invention of his rifle.

The design is simple, easily fabricated, and rugged. Not much in the way of training is required in its use and routine maintenance.

It truly is an Infantryman's weapon.

When I first got my hands on one in the service a few of us "new guys" sat around and in just a short time had figured out how to disassemble and reassemble it. Didn't need any instruction book.

kalashnikov and John Moses Browning's 1911 are probably the greatest small weapon inventions of the last century.

Are there better weapons out now? Sure, but these two have stood the test of time and continue to do so.
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Old 11-30-2017, 11:56 PM   #47
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I don't think its a question, the AK's impact on the world is extremely difficult to understate... its the most widely-produced firearm in history, after all!

But just because it has changed the world, doesn't mean it has transformed warfare. Small arms design has always been a small factor of warfare, unless you have something vastly superior to the enemy... Usually, the winning army is the one with superior logistics, industrial strength, manpower. Not the one with the better gun designs - we can see this in World War 2.

As a response to somebody's statement of Africa having "better gun rights" than we do, I would challenge that statement. I have spent significant time in the Middle East, I have friends who have visited and lived in nearly ever nation in the African continent. Gun rights are practically non-existent, if you own a firearm its because the government is corrupt, ineffective, and has little to no ability to enforce its own laws. Notice, most African and Middle Eastern governments are undemocratic and it makes no sense for them to support "gun rights," what are they getting out of that??
Life works differently over there... I much prefer America to any other country. We have our own issues but when it comes to gun rights, I struggle to think of anyone better than we.

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Old 12-01-2017, 08:08 AM   #48
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Th AK pattern rifle was proliferated by the Soviet Union and the commblov nations and China as noted earlier.
Other countries like the USA or western Europe were less inclined to supply weapons to many countries.
Military firearms are manufactured for durability and ease of routine maintenance.
The AK is a bit easier than some.
Others like the M16 are much easier to assemble from parts and repair generally.

Last edited by AKBLUE; 12-01-2017 at 02:21 PM. Reason: typos
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Old 12-01-2017, 02:06 PM   #49
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Th AK paytern rifle was proliferated by the Soviet Union and the commblov nations and China as noted earlier.
Other countries like the USA or western Europe were less inclined to supply weapons to many countries.
Military firearms are manufactured for dirability and ease of routine maintenance.
The AK is a bit easier than some.
Othrts like the M16 are much easier to assemble from parts and repair generally.




That may be true however the AK is less likely to break in the first place. It's a far more durable platform than the M16.
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Old 12-01-2017, 02:30 PM   #50
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[/B]

That may be true however the AK is less likely to break in the first place. It's a far more durable platform than the M16.
True., But then so is virtually all the military ordnance used by the US military., tanks, fighter aircraft, stealth bombers, nuclear subs, aircraft carriers. Likely the most complex in the world.

Effectiveness is sometimes measured in durability and sometimes in effective performance.., eg., accuracy, ergonomics, modular design etc. or a combination. Time and evolution of design can enhance some of these factors as well.

Both the M16/M4 and the AK pattern firearms are effective firearms. Has either been an innovation that stands far above other implements of war/battle.
I guess that is a discussion that will continue and extends from the adoption of mounted horse cavalry, steel body armor, gun powder, smokeless powder, artillery, heavy and light machineguns etc.
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Old 12-01-2017, 04:42 PM   #51
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True., But then so is virtually all the military ordnance used by the US military., tanks, fighter aircraft, stealth bombers, nuclear subs, aircraft carriers. Likely the most complex in the world.

Effectiveness is sometimes measured in durability and sometimes in effective performance.., eg., accuracy, ergonomics, modular design etc. or a combination. Time and evolution of design can enhance some of these factors as well.

Both the M16/M4 and the AK pattern firearms are effective firearms. Has either been an innovation that stands far above other implements of war/battle.
I guess that is a discussion that will continue and extends from the adoption of mounted horse cavalry, steel body armor, gun powder, smokeless powder, artillery, heavy and light machineguns etc.
I'm talking in the context of the 3rd world, No ICBM's or Aircraft Carriers needed. lol

If you were following along I mentioned on post#7 that not having the AK47 would not effect a organized Army. (that was my point) The AK47/AKM was very effective in the 3rd world. (my other point) no need to overthink think this.
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Old 12-01-2017, 04:53 PM   #52
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I'm talking in the context of the 3rd world, No ICBM's or Aircraft Carriers needed. lol

If you were following along I mentioned on post#7 that not having the AK47 would not effect a organized Army. (that was my point) The AK47/AKM was very effective in the 3rd world. (my other point) no need to overthink think this.
There is really very little difference in the ability of an operator to use a military firearm. Whether a AK, M16, Galil etc. Simplicity and ease of use is commmon in light weapons from virtually all countries.
The supply source, cost and support by the Soviet Union and other communist countries was the driving force.
Pretty simple history of the proliferation of the firearm.
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Old 12-01-2017, 06:17 PM   #53
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Quote:
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There is really very little difference in the ability of an operator to use a military firearm. Whether a AK, M16, Galil etc. Simplicity and ease of use is commmon in light weapons from virtually all countries.
The supply source, cost and support by the Soviet Union and other communist countries was the driving force.
Pretty simple history of the proliferation of the firearm.
Not to mention that there is overland passage from all of the primary producers of the AK(M) to all of the hotspots in the ME and Africa. That makes those weapons a whole lot easier to source than American weapons for the most part. Unless of course you are the proxy du jour for American foreign policy.
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Old 12-01-2017, 06:43 PM   #54
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Interesting thought. Here is my .02

As was said above, mass-produced rifles started upon the world stage in WWII. Building An AK-47 was not all that different than building an M1 Garand. Both required reasonably skilled labor. Now the AKM is simpler, but still, as we have discovered it has to be built right. For a reliable, long-lasting AK, you need forged trunnions, carriers, and a CHF barrel. They have to be built right, not perfect, but right.

The reason there are, by the latest estimate, close to 200 million AKs in the world, is because there were dozens and dozens of factories set up and paid for by the communist bloc.

In all honesty, using today's manufacturing, an AR is a lot easier to build than an AK and there is a lot more give in the design. Not the same reliability.

Magazine fed rifles changed warfare, the AK was just a part of that.
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